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Old 02-11-2005, 12:04 PM   #1
SDMFUK
 
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Nirvana's legacy

I thought I'd post this separately to the other Nirvana post as it isn't aimed at provoking anyone and the other seems to be heated.

I am curious, seeing the amount of emotion that the other debate caused, what's your take on Nirvana's legacy? What do you think they contributed to music?
I know they shook things up greatly, this isn't the question.

I would like to know how you think they changed things and what you think their lasting influence is.

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Old 02-11-2005, 04:34 PM   #2
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Their music lives on in bands like Korn,Limp Bizkit,Creed, etc.

Their fans should be proud of that.
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Old 02-12-2005, 12:57 AM   #3
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I thought Kurt was a excellent songwriter. Not the kind of music to which I listen most frequently, but once in a while is okay.
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Originally Posted by That 70s Guy
Their music lives on in bands like Korn,Limp Bizkit,Creed, etc.
What?!?!? I don't hear any of Nirvana in any of those.
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Old 02-12-2005, 04:42 AM   #4
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

The great thing about Nirvana is that they synthesized a lot of things that had been bubbling in the underground for years. Their music came at exactly the right time...a time when popular music needed a good kick up the backside. "Nevermind" in particular had a broad appeal because at its heart it was still a pop rock album. Sure, the guitars were loud and Kurt screamed a lot of the lyrics, but the production made it all go down smooth as ice water.

They weren't completely reinventing the wheel or anything...but then again, they never claimed to. Kurt often described their sound as "The Knack being molested by Black Sabbath."

I really hate when people say "if Nirvana were still around today their stock would have dropped," or whatever. People do this with John Lennon too. You can sit around and theorize and hypothesize all day long, but you can't change history. Like John Lennon's career, Nirvana's career stopped at a point where their legacy was going to be sealed.

I think you can also thank groups like Nirvana and R.E.M. for the higher profile that indie and alternative music has acheived throughout the years. These days, it's a lot easier to discover non-mainstream music, if you're willing to do a little searching. No, you can't just flick on MTV or the radio and find cool new music. But nowadays, there's a much bigger network of people attuned to what underground and non-mainstream artists are doing. The level of consciousness has been raised.

The band left behind a legacy of great songwriting and raw, human emotion. They had a great group dynamic and their music still resonates with people a decade later. If they "sucked," as many claimed, they wouldn't continue to inspire and resonate with people a decade on. I've run into many people who don't like them, and that's fine, but you can't deny they were a major force in rock in the early '90s, and continue to be a major force today.
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Old 02-12-2005, 04:46 AM   #5
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dusty Chalk
I thought Kurt was a excellent songwriter. Not the kind of music to which I listen most frequently, but once in a while is okay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by That 70s Guy
Their music lives on in bands like Korn,Limp Bizkit,Creed, etc.
What?!?!? I don't hear any of Nirvana in any of those.
Well, I do a little bit, but only in so much as people have been trying to rip off that icy, polished, distorted guitar sound that Butch Vig perfected on "Nevermind."

And I see where That 70s Guy is heading with that point, and I think it's completely asinine. If you're going to "blame" Nirvana for the poor bands that came in their wake, you have to do the same for every major pop and rock act of the 20th century. Any major artist always spawns dozens of less interesting (and often less successful) imitators.
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Old 02-12-2005, 10:54 AM   #6
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Heres what I think about Nirvana...

They were a damn good band. They had alot of good songs. But when people say how great they are, it makes me sick! Okay, so lets see. They started the "Grunge Movement"

Where is the grunge movement now? It was more of a "Grunge FAD"
And a shitty fad at that.

I mean what did they really influence? Shitty modern rock bands? Wow, thats something to be really impressed about. "Hey! Look! I influnced a whole generation of 4th wave punk rock bands!"

Lets just look at a few of the bands that are considered "great"
Beatles - DO I even have to talk about how they greatly influenced music?
Rolling Stones - People knew they couldn't be the beatles, so they tried to be the stones, which is unmeasurably influential. The badass image, especially in the early 60s.
Dylan - The early protest songs: him being the "Voice of a generation" The times, BLowin in the wind, Hard rain's gonna fall.
To "Like A Rolling Stone" changing the modern rock song forever.

How can Nirvana even compare to any of those "Great" acts? They cannot be considered being one of the "greatest groups of all time"

Also all of the "great bands" have a much larger discography. 4 or 5 albums isn't enough for anybody.
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Old 02-12-2005, 11:23 AM   #7
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDMFUK
I thought I'd post this separately to the other Nirvana post as it isn't aimed at provoking anyone and the other seems to be heated...
See, there's your problem! The mere mention of the name brings out the sheer, unadulterated hatred (see second post). There are many here who simply despise them. Period! They will brook no other opinion. Alas, Martin and maybe NewDawnFades or a couple of others will attempt to defend, but it's to no avail. There is no tolerance for the holey jeans-ed ones here. You're fighting a losing battle, my friend.

Just don't, for God's sake, mention Rap whatever you do!
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Old 02-12-2005, 12:42 PM   #8
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Chick, that's where even talking about Nirvana gets stupid. No one should have to defend them. You got to be a little objective about the music you are talking about. If there is a group that I want to comment on, and I know I don't like them, I am going to tell you that and offer my opinion. I am not going to try to prove to you WHY they suck because I understand the difference between my preference and the quality of a band's music. It's pretty sad. So that's my peace on this and I ain't going to talk to those who don't understand the difference between the two.
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Old 02-12-2005, 01:08 PM   #9
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

I think they are great... more rock and roll for me!!!!

I just don't get why some can't be so eclectic and liberal in their music.

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Old 02-12-2005, 01:34 PM   #10
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewDawnFades
Chick, that's where even talking about Nirvana gets stupid. No one should have to defend them. You got to be a little objective about the music you are talking about. If there is a group that I want to comment on, and I know I don't like them, I am going to tell you that and offer my opinion. I am not going to try to prove to you WHY they suck because I understand the difference between my preference and the quality of a band's music. It's pretty sad. So that's my peace on this and I ain't going to talk to those who don't understand the difference between the two.
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Old 02-12-2005, 01:34 PM   #11
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

I ued to be a complete hater of nirvana, mainly cause I was trying to fit into the 'other crowd' and pretend to hate them a lot. But recently I've been listening to the copy of In Utero I got from my sister and it is a lot better than I imagined. I'll be checking out some more of their stuff as the time goes by,
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Old 02-12-2005, 01:36 PM   #12
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

That is it, Black Dog... it is one of those "band wagon" things, like Zep haters. I can't see the unfounded hate. Everyone has their taste in music... let it all be welcome!

Sure, we can opine as to why we dislike certain things... but to preach to others that it just plain sucks? I never got that.
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Old 02-12-2005, 05:32 PM   #13
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Nevermind is one of the greatest albums of all time....certainly in the top 25 if not the Top 10. That said...it may have been a case of "premature dying" thats led to Cobains name being spoken along with other legendary rock figures who died early.

The only difference IMO, is that Cobain really didnt leave behind as much material as others. 3 or 4 albums along with some demos is about all she wrote while at least Jim Morrison and the Doors had a nice catalogue. Also take in mind that Dave Grohls Post Nirvana work is pretty damn impressive that might lead to evidence of the collaborative efforts of the band as whole as opposed to just Cobain.

Flame on!
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Old 02-12-2005, 05:57 PM   #14
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by That 70s Guy
Their music lives on in bands like Korn,Limp Bizkit,Creed, etc.

Their fans should be proud of that.
The words of an obsessed man.

1) You hate NIRVANA and every 2 posts you take the opportunity to slag them off. May I reassure you? We, the world, the entire universe know you hate them by now.

2) To reiterate your anti-Nirvana campaign, you enlist a series of bands that ARE THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF NIRVANA because you perceive that these very bands are generally hated by this board. Obviously, you are not even arsed to explain why they should sound similiar.

3) As the best NIRVANA-HATER in the fucking world, you end your statement by "saying" that their fans (in your eyes, criminals, no more no less) should feel ashamed because there are other bands you hate

One thing is to dislike a band, another one is to be a flatulent pain in the arse, as Morrissey once put it

Get a life
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Old 02-12-2005, 05:59 PM   #15
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by chick draper
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDMFUK
I thought I'd post this separately to the other Nirvana post as it isn't aimed at provoking anyone and the other seems to be heated...
See, there's your problem! The mere mention of the name brings out the sheer, unadulterated hatred (see second post). There are many here who simply despise them. Period! They will brook no other opinion. Alas, Martin and maybe NewDawnFades or a couple of others will attempt to defend, but it's to no avail. There is no tolerance for the holey jeans-ed ones here. You're fighting a losing battle, my friend.

Just don't, for God's sake, mention Rap whatever you do!


I read it AFTER answering...
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Old 02-12-2005, 06:55 PM   #16
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich
I think they are great... more rock and roll for me!!!!

I just don't get why some can't be so eclectic and liberal in their music.

Amen.
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Old 02-12-2005, 07:54 PM   #17
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBeatle
The only difference IMO, is that Cobain really didnt leave behind as much material as others. 3 or 4 albums along with some demos is about all she wrote while at least Jim Morrison and the Doors had a nice catalogue.
That's interesting that you mention Nirvana in the same breath as the Doors, HB, because I often ally the two myself.

The Doors' catalogue is a little bigger than Nirvana's, but they are roughly the same size. The Doors had six studio albums and a live one, Nirvana had three studio albums, one b-sides compilation and a live one. Both The Doors and Nirvana were only making records for four years and both lost their frontmen at age 27. Both frontmen have been somewhat deified since their death.

Quote:
Also take in mind that Dave Grohls Post Nirvana work is pretty damn impressive that might lead to evidence of the collaborative efforts of the band as whole as opposed to just Cobain.
Yeah, much of Dave's first Foo Fighters album consisted of stuff he'd been recording privately for a couple of years. And don't forget Dave penned and sang the Nirvana b-side "Marigold."
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Old 02-12-2005, 08:06 PM   #18
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Re: Nirvana's legacy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Jones
Heres what I think about Nirvana...

They were a damn good band. They had alot of good songs. But when people say how great they are, it makes me sick!
:confused:

So they're "damn good" but not "great"? So it's purely an issue of semantics that draws your ire?

Quote:
Okay, so lets see. They started the "Grunge Movement"

Where is the grunge movement now? It was more of a "Grunge FAD"
Who cares? It does absolutely nothing to diminish their greatness.

And as I said above, the success of Nirvana made the record companies think twice about what was bankable. I stand by my assertion that alternative, indie rock, punk, whatever is much easier to hunt down now than it was in 1991. At least there are more avenues and networks now for people to find that stuff. There is a greater level of awareness.

Quote:
I mean what did they really influence? Shitty modern rock bands? Wow, thats something to be really impressed about. "Hey! Look! I influnced a whole generation of 4th wave punk rock bands!"
I'm beginning to wonder if you have even read this thread. You can't sit back and blame one band for all the inferior imitators they spawned. If you're going to conveniently do that for Nirvana, you have to do that for a lot of other popular bands, such as...

Quote:
Beatles - DO I even have to talk about how they greatly influenced music?
Rolling Stones - People knew they couldn't be the beatles, so they tried to be the stones, which is unmeasurably influential. The badass image, especially in the early 60s.
Dylan - The early protest songs: him being the "Voice of a generation" The times, BLowin in the wind, Hard rain's gonna fall.
To "Like A Rolling Stone" changing the modern rock song forever.
You're saying there's no way that any of these major artists influenced any bad music and inferior imitators? If anything, they've influenced more garbage than Nirvana, due to how much more popular they were than Nirvana, and how much longer they were around.

Quote:
Also all of the "great bands" have a much larger discography. 4 or 5 albums isn't enough for anybody.
Then you'd have to disqualify The Doors, Jimi Hendrix and Janis Joplin from the list of "great artists," among others.
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